Monday, April 16, 2012

Red Announces 6K 120fps Sensor with 15+ Stops DR

Reduser.net, Slashgear, Engadget: A year ago Red announced an oncoming sensor upgrade for its EPIC and Scarlet cameras. However, Red was reluctant to release any details about the new sensor, named Dragon. This year the details an the timing of the Red Dragon have been released:


The sensor's speed is 85fps at full 6K resolution, or 120fps at 5K resolution. The new sensor features 5um pixels and 30 mm x 15.8 mm optical array size. Red says that the native DR of Dragon sensor is greater than 15 stops.


Vimeo video shows Red's excitement over the new sensor introduction:

Posted by Vladimir Koifman at 22:21

23 comments:

  1. AnonymousApril 16, 2012 at 10:48 PM

    I wonder who makes the sensor for these guys?

    ReplyDelete
  2. Dave GilblomApril 16, 2012 at 11:17 PM

    We didn't make this one but if you need a sensor like this, send me $2.5 million and wait 12 months and it's yours.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Dave GilblomApril 17, 2012 at 7:23 PM

      From the notes below, I need to clarify the offer:

      Global shutter to 1 usec, 99.9999% efficiency

      Delete
    2. Vladimir KoifmanApril 17, 2012 at 10:38 PM

      Global shutter must be interesting for Red and its competitors, like ARRI. So, you offer:

      24MP sensor with 5um pixels
      84fps speed at full resolution
      15-16b-equivalent ADC resolution at full speed
      Global shutter efficiency of 120dB (at what conditions?)
      Low read noise (how much?)
      Chip area is roughly 2x of the array area (like in Red Dragon)
      Power is low enough (how much?)

      Hope I'm not asking too many questions.

      Delete
    3. Dave GilblomApril 18, 2012 at 6:23 AM

      Vladimir,

      Yes to almost all but I didn't want this to get too commercial. I just wanted to indicate that these days money can buy pretty much anything in CMOS imagers.

      With a 5 um pixel, the read noise can be about 2-3 electrons and the full well is around 200ke-. The shutter transistor is behind a multilayer reflector that separates the photodiodes from all of the curcuitry. This also allows the fill factor to be near 100%.

      However, the chip isn't much bigger than the active array. This sort of device requires a lot of output taps. The power would be in the 0.8 to 1 watt range because of this.

      Maybe Eric is right, though, I should have said 15 months.

      Send me an e-mail and I can send you some documents. dave@alt-vision.com

      Delete
    4. AnonymousApril 18, 2012 at 2:33 PM

      Dave, I don't know much about this field but how can you get 100% fill factor in FSI pixel? And the 2 electron noise? And 200ke- (and its low conversion factor)? Conclusion: Aptina and Sony guys are beginners?

      Delete
    5. Dave GilblomApril 18, 2012 at 4:30 PM

      No, they are not beginners. They just keep doing what they have always done, probably because they are in big companies. Just using a term like FSI already limits thinking. There is actually a lot of creative stuff going on, just not much at places like Sony and Aptina any more.

      For technical details, see our website.

      Delete
    6. AnonymousApril 18, 2012 at 10:30 PM

      Did not see many technical details on your website. Can you please post links to your (white) papers?

      Delete
    7. Dave GilblomApril 19, 2012 at 4:36 AM

      Send me an e-mail and I can send you more details.

      dave@alt-vision.com

      Delete
  3. Eric R FossumApril 16, 2012 at 11:30 PM

    12 months would be pretty quick, considering design time, fab time, characterization, no doubt at least one re-spin....and then there is qual.

    ReplyDelete
  4. GodOfSmallThingsApril 17, 2012 at 8:27 AM

    Maybe they make their own sensors. Just like some heavyweights. Wonder what fab can deliver this performance on the pixel capacity.

    ReplyDelete
  5. AnonymousApril 17, 2012 at 2:56 PM

    Is this a rolling shutter sensor or snapshoot one??

    ReplyDelete
  6. Vladimir KoifmanApril 17, 2012 at 5:03 PM

    @ "I wonder who makes the sensor for these guys?"

    All this info is NDA-ed. The best you can do is a LinkedIn search and some guesswork.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. AnonymousApril 18, 2012 at 1:13 AM

      Thanks Vladimir..I think I have a rough idea now :)

      Delete
  7. Daniel BrowningApril 17, 2012 at 6:41 PM

    * Anon said:
    > Is this a rolling shutter sensor or snapshoot one??

    Rolling shutter. The CEO (Jim Jannard) confirmed it on reduser.net. He said that read-reset time was improved compared to their previous sensors.

    ReplyDelete
  8. AnonymousApril 17, 2012 at 8:18 PM

    so what is special with this sensor?

    ReplyDelete
  9. AnonymousApril 18, 2012 at 3:41 AM

    "I wonder who makes the sensor for these guys?"

    There aren't too many foundries who would be willing to take on this low wafer volume - my best guess is TowerJazz (Israel foundry).

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. GodOfSmallThingsApril 18, 2012 at 8:54 AM

      But doesn't TowerJazz suffer from poor yields and antiquated geometry, a few years ago they were still at 0.18um.

      Delete
  10. AnonymousApril 18, 2012 at 5:36 PM

    TowerJazz's 0.18um offer a wide-field stepper with max dies size of 25.55 mm x 32.55 mm. Given Red's dies size, one more piece of evidence, they are using TowreJazz.

    Yields are subjective. We have been using TowerJazz for many years for our large dies and have been quite happy with them. I don't know what Red's acceptance criteria is for a good die, but if they can tolerate a couple of rows or columns, TowerJazz would be OK.

    ReplyDelete
  11. AnonymousApril 18, 2012 at 10:41 PM

    Very poor mfg support

    ReplyDelete
  12. AnonymousApril 21, 2012 at 11:29 PM

    Who is Dave Gilblom, please?

    ReplyDelete
  13. AnonymousApril 21, 2012 at 11:31 PM

    Is this gentleman :
    http://www.linkedin.com/pub/david-gilblom/1/a9a/492

    ReplyDelete

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